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I recommend you shy away from HARWELL MOTORS in Denton, TX. They will sell you something you do not expect. For example, take this
‘65 Chevelle convertible.
Here’s the “sales” write-up, from the Craig’s list ad (302k see it here) and the EBAY item (see it here, 2.5mb):
“You are viewing a 1965 Chevrolet Chevelle convertible with a 4 speed manual transmission. This beautiful car comes equipped with a white canvas convertible top with power up and
down, black leather bucket seats, a 327 V8 engine, center console, and much more. This rust free car has been professionally detailed inside and out and is ready for some serious cruising. This
straight bodied Chevelle has good chrome and the pictures definitely don't do it justice. Be sure to submit all offers to Hunter Smith at Harwell Motor Company 940-367-7658 or call with any
questions.”
Click either of the 2 links above to see the original ads, the exact wording, and some very nice pictures. Now, let’s break down the ad and compare it with reality.
- “1965 Chevrolet Chevelle convertible with a 4 speed manual transmission”
- “This beautiful car”
- An opinion that can be debated (does look great in the pictures though)
- “convertible top with power up and down”
- Well, there was a power top motor.... of course, no switch to try it out, and I didn’t bother looking for how to activate the motor.
- “center console”
- Well, it was a ‘console’, not mounted at all. I chucked it in the trash. See the links above for pictures of the JC Whitney special console.
- “This rust free car”
- Ahh, now this is a grand statement. Where I come from, “rust free’, is... well, there’s no rust. In other words “free from rust”. Now, I knew this was an
unrestored 43 year old car. I would expect a little, but when it says “rust free”, I would expect a pretty clean car? Well, at least I would expect it out of an honest and
reputable dealer....
- My analysis, and every person who saw the car? JUNK! The car is FULL of bondo! See the pictures below for some examples. It was even risky just getting in the car! See
the jagged/rusty QTR window trim in the pics below.
- The dash was even rusted enough I could stick a finger through! I’ve never even owned a “driver” car that had that much rust! I have a parts car that is in better
shape in these areas.
- The trunk had been patched, but a lot of it was the trunk spatter paint over rust.
- I should’ve taken a picture of the battery tray “replacement” (maybe a piece of a floor pan??)
- I’ve posted a few pics below to show you a Harwell Motors “rust free car”.
- “ready for some serious cruising”
- I wouldn’t even drive it around the block!
- Runs rich enough to burn your eyes
- Leaks oil all over the floor
- Right front wheel cylinder leaks down the tire (that’s real safe)
- No brake lights! Unplugged, why? Because the brake lights stay on all the time.
- Starter died after about the 10th start (I know, sold ‘as is’).
- Very difficult to get into Reverse gear because the seats get in the way, even when slid all the way back, and/or the shift linkage was binding.
- No seals at all around the canvas top, no seal at all around the trunk lid, door seals cracked/dry rotted.
- Driver side door doesn’t shut well (you can see why in the pics below)
- It takes 2 people to roll up the rear windows! I’ve even included a a video to demonstrate at the bottom of this page.
- Wires hanging under the dash (I didn’t bother to even see what they were for). See some pics of this below.
- Rear antennae was loose and just hanging on.
- Power Steering pump reservoir was EMTPY, and whined as such. They couldn’t even put in some power steering fluid? Or maybe they did, and it all leaked out?
- The oil on the dipstick looked more like sludge than oil. Obviously hadn’t been changed in a LONG time.
- Would you consider that “ready for some serious cruising” ?
- “This straight bodied Chevelle”
- The hood and trunk lid were straight, and the fenders pretty decent. The doors, rockers, qtrs, trunk lip, inner wheel wells, etc, are full of bondo.
- The driver’s side door was “splitting” at the top, such that you could stick your hand up to your thumb down in between the window and the outer door skin! Wow.
- You can see the bondo and waves from 30’ away! No where near a “straight bodied” car. The pictures of the car make it look pretty sweet, I must admit.
- “good chrome”
- Still looking for it. See some example pictures below. The chrome is all original, pitted, bent, dented. The front/rear window trim might clean up fairly well, but the rest of it
needs restored or replaced. Far from “good” chrome.
- “the pictures definitely don't do it justice”
- Agreed, the pictures barely resemble the true condition of the car. Irony at it’s best.
- I’ve now learned a couple of techniques for taking highly deceptive pictures. The use of shade is a good one to note. Catching the sunlight just right is another good one.
This car needs a total restoration. It is wore out, very poorly patched together, and certainly is not even worthy of a ‘driver’ as I was expecting. I suppose that is
subject to opinion, but thus far, I’ve not found anyone else who would agree that it is of ‘driver’ quality. And I’d bet that Mr. John Ray didn’t choose this car as one
of his weekend rides.
$19,900 for that! Certainly not, how about $17,900? Nope? The highest estimated market value I could get from various reviews was $12,000, lowest was $6,000. I call that a
pretty good scam.
So, what did the owner of Harwell Motors, John Ray, have to say? Here’s some snippets from our conversations on the phone:
- “too bad”
- “my opinion of a driver’ is ‘different than your’s”
- “that was written up by a salesman, for the purpose of selling the car”
- “you should’ve asked more questions”
- I did ask some questions of the salesman, but clearly, not nearly enough. This was definitely a fault of mine.
- I also specifically asked John Ray in an email the following: “Is there anything on the car that doesn't work? Like the wipers? lights, etc? Especially anything that might
make me NOT want to drive it back to Indianapolis?"
As I look back, these weren’t even answered, except to say that “I would suggest having it shipped”. (I
can provide the email). He didn't mention that the brake lights don't work (not plugged in) or that they don't go off when they are plugged in (which is undoubtedly why they
were unplugged). He didn't mention the leaky wheel cylinder (clearly another safety issue), nor the empty power steering reservoir, that it badly needed an oil change...
- And I especially enjoyed being called the nasty names, and insults. To me, that really reveals what kind of character a person has. Is that the kind of person you want to deal with?
- And John Ray insists it is worth $17,900. As you review the pictures below, let me know if you think it would be worth $17,900.
As you might imagine, he wasn’t the least bit interested in getting this “beautiful” ‘65 Chevelle back on his lot. He found a sucker, and I’m sure was thrilled to see it
go. I even offered to pay 100% of his expenses to trade back a real nice ‘69 Camaro. Am I wrong, or wouldn’t most ‘stand up’ businesses stand behind their dealings, and
at least try to “make it right” with the customer?
It is my opinion, that if they had a shred of honesty/decency, something could’ve been worked out. Nope, nothing but blame on the customer, “too bad”, nasty names and
insults. I guess they are a sterotypical “used car lot”.
How did I end up with such a car? I traded it for a ‘69 real nice restored ‘69 Camaro. I paid a driver, who is also a friend, to go get it for me, which he did exactly as I
asked and paid for. I didn’t ask for an evaluation, as I believed (my mistake) that Harwell Motors would be a reputable dealer. I was wrong, very wrong.
The terms of the deal were negotiated (between myself and John Ray) down to:
- An even trade of the ‘69 Camaro (See it here) for the ‘65 Chevelle.
- The Camaro needed a carpet (only because the existing carpet was cut incorrectly), needed the A/C installation finished (all brand new Vintage Air system), and I gave him the original unrestored
seats (as was requested by John Ray). The guy who originally restored the car didn’t want the trim, door handles, etc, so that’s how the car was done (plain and
simple). These points were reviewed verbally with a salesperson (Josh), and Josh reviewed in the pictures sent (see link above), and Josh told me he would pass the info along to John Ray.
Additionally, I included most of those facts in an email directly to John Ray (I can provide the email).
- Split the cost of shipping 50/50, which was $500 each.
- Harwell Motors (Hunter) said that he would send out the check on a Thursday, such that it would be at my house on Monday, in time for me to give it to the shipper leaving out on Tuesday(see more
on the shipping below). The fact is that they didn’t send it, and I called on Friday to inquire. I was told it would go out in Friday’s mail. I called on Monday to
inquire, and it hadn’t been mailed yet. I suggested they hold it and give it to the driver, which is what happened. This was not a big deal, but I find it interesting.
- Harwell Motors would keep the Chevy Rally wheels that you see in the pictures on the ‘65, because they didn’t want the aluminum wheels that were on the Camaro (because they are “not
as marketable”).
- There was no exchange of money on the deal, and no deposit required (which makes sense on the Harwell Motors end since the ‘65 wasn’t likely to be going anywhere, and the Camaro was
coming directly to them).
- Harwell Motors did lower the price on the bill of sale because " ....we are trying to show a low trade so you dont get killed on taxes." That turns out to be a nice
gesture, but I learned that in Indiana, there are no state sales taxes on an even trade.
These are the terms ended up after 2-3 iterations of offers/counter offers. My original offer was to trade, with Harwell Motors paying the shipping ($1,000) and giving me $1,200, and did not include
the original seats nor them keeping the Chevy Rally wheels on the ‘65. I willingly came down to their final counter-offers, assuming the ‘65 was as advertised. Had it been as
advertised, I would’ve been quite happy with the deal.
How about some pictures of the reality of an example of what Harwell Motors sells as “beautiful” “rust free”, “straight bodied Chevelle” with “good chrome”
and is “ready for some serious cruising”?
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